267 How to Be a Relentlessly Positive Leader with Rear Admiral Kyle Cozad | Partnering Leadership Global Thought Leader

***DISCLAIMER: Please note that the following AI-generated transcript may not be 100% accurate and could contain misspellings or errors.***

[00:00:00] Mahan Tavakoli: Admiral Kyle Coza. Welcome to Partnering Leadership. I am thrilled to have you in this conversation with me. 

[00:00:05] Kyle Cozad: Mahan. Thanks so much. I feel we're long lost friends based on our previous conversations that we have.

So excited to be here today. Thanks. Admiral, 

[00:00:13] Mahan Tavakoli: what a joy and honor having read your book, relentless Positivity, A Common Veteran. Now, I would challenge you on the title of the book, but we'll leave that for now. A common veteran battling uncommon Odds, and you have battled uncommon odds with extreme positivity.

But before we get to that, would love to know, Admiral, whereabouts you grew up and how your upbringing impacted the kind of person you've. 

[00:00:41] Kyle Cozad: Absolutely. And that all goes back to family. I grew up in Las Vegas, Nevada. My parents were both teachers. And we had a very traditional family.

We'd go to school in the morning, we'd all eat breakfast together. We'd come home, we'd eat dinner together, we'd did our homework. All my brothers and sister play sports. Really it was the values that mom and dad instilled in each one of us. And that was, you need to be honest, honesty above everything else.

And, when we think about leadership, that's such an important quality. We talked about compassion. Compassion as a family and we see this epidemic of bullying today. And, it's that golden rule. Do unto others as you would have others do unto you. And.

The value of hard work. My dad was a basketball player. When he was in high school? I played basketball in high school and then again for a couple years at the Naval Academy. And, the word can't was never in our vocabulary. It was always try harder and continue to try even harder.

And so I think it's those values in having. The relationship with a traditional family really helped shape me, through the formative years of my life and then throughout my military career and even to today. 

[00:01:45] Mahan Tavakoli: So you had that nurturing environment growing up. Did you aspire to join?

The Navy or military, how did that come about? 

[00:01:56] Kyle Cozad: So I had a good friend who was a neighbor, lived right across the street from us. And he really sparked my interest. He was an Air Force F 15 Squadron commanding officer and he took me out to Nellis Air Force Base and Las Vegas one day. And, just showed me around, showed me the jets.

And, I thought it was really cool. Two weeks after that I got to go flying an a Cessna with a friend of ours. And I decided then and there I knew nothing about the military other than what I'd seen that one day at Nellis Air Force Base. But I decided that, that looked like a pretty cool way of making a living, jumping in an airplane and going flying.

Had nothing to do with my leadership aspirations. Nothing to do with anything other than I wanna be a pilot that looks pretty. 

[00:02:38] Mahan Tavakoli: Admiral, you ended up at the Naval Academy right outside of DC in Annapolis, Maryland. Beautiful place for people to go see. And the conversations I've had with different people that have served in the Navy, they say that first year can be pretty rough.

[00:02:56] Kyle Cozad: Yeah. And for me, I'll be honest with you, all four years were rough. I was not a natural academic back to the, hard work ethic and, you have to study harder, you have to practice harder than anybody else. Ended up there in, quite frankly, the only reason I got into the Naval Academy was.

Because I was an athlete, I was a basketball player, and so that overcame some, high school grades. My grade point average was good, but my standard test scores weren't, quite to what average looked like at the Naval Academy. Basketball opened the door at the Naval Academy for me.

And that first year it's just so different cuz I did not come from a military family. I had no idea what to expect, showed up there. They want you to do a left face and a right face. And I thought I'm not smart enough. I'll never get this stuff. And you work your way through the summer and you get homesick and it seems really hard.

And then the next thing you know, you start your academic year. And for me, I didn't have a very robust academic structure when I was in high school. I didn't take physics. I didn't take trigonometry. I didn't take a bunch of the higher level classes that a lot of my peers did at the academy.

To say that I struggled mightily in the classroom is probably an understatement. I'll tell you one funny story that my wife loves me to tell. The second year I was. And remember, you're up at five 30 in the morning. You have to memorize a bunch of things as part of your military life.

You have mandatory meals that you attend. I was carrying 22 classroom credit hours every semester. And then you go to basketball practice and you work out and then you're expected to do your homework after that. My very first semester, grade point average, Was 1.35, and I wish I could lie to you and tell you that was on a 2.0 scale.

But again the character that my family instilled in me in, when I lived at home with them tells me I can't do that. I just really struggled in come sophomore year. I had one of our academic advisors sit down with me and he said Mitch, Jim and Kozad what do you wanna do with your life?

Do you wanna graduate and be an officer in the Navy? Or do you wanna go on and be a professional basketball player? I said number two is never gonna happen. He said, I completely agree with you. It's time for you to focus on the classroom and hang up the Chuck Taylors. And that's exactly what I did.

In a sense, I was not medically retired due to injury. I was academically, 

[00:05:05] Mahan Tavakoli: good for you for making that decision. And this is, by the way, part of why I love reading your book , because you have genuine humility in sharing these stories and examples, which is really important for leaders in that it.

Helps people access your humanity. Now Admiral, another person who's actually an author, David Marque. Written a couple of bestselling books. He was a commander of a submarine, s Santa Fe, and he jokes a little bit about. When he entered the Naval Academy, which is around the same time that you did.

The definition of leadership revolved primarily around, , the leader. Commanding and telling people what to do, and eventually through his experience, he found that wasn't the best way to lead. You have been very successful and had a very successful military career. The military has evolved.

How did your view on leadership evolve from when you were trained at the academy to when you started your service? 

[00:06:16] Kyle Cozad: That, that's a great question, and I'll probably expand that to when I started my service and then, as I continued to mature as a leader. So first off, David and I served indirectly together.

He was an executive assistant in DC and I was an executive assistant in Millington. So I know him well and he is a respected leader. But you're absolutely right. So his takeaway was really the same as mine. And when I was at the academy, we had very few enlisted folks on the yard.

We didn't have any senior enlisted, we didn't have any junior enlisted other than when we went out on, the various summer cruises or yard. Patrol craft. And my formative year was really when I got to my very first squadron and I had a Chief petty officer who, took me under his wing and he taught me.

And it didn't take long for me to realize that, it wasn't about me directing others what to do. It was about me, number one, getting to know. On a personal basis. So you gotta really know your people. That's maybe cliche-ish to some but it's also, having them respect you for how you approach, the fine art of leadership.

In your honesty, in your transparency you can say that my people come first. And then when you're that guy who says, we're gonna stay here till 11 o'clock at night, I don't care if it's, a second birthday or, a fourth anniversary for you, you really have to walk the walk and talk the talk.

 I had somebody describe my leadership style is the dad factor. They were never worried about getting yelled at. They were never worried about anything other than disappointing me as the commander. And I think, that kind of speaks volumes for itself because you have people who buy in to not only, it wasn't about.

Buying into me, but it was about buying into the mission. And when people do things out of a motivation not to disappoint and be the best that they can be. I think that's a pretty strong statement. 

[00:08:01] Mahan Tavakoli: It is. And a lot of times, better than anyone else I've had conversations with, Different people that have served in special forces as well.

Rich Vinney was in the seals for 20 plus years, and part of what he talks about is that connection that the individuals also develop for each other. So there is the purpose, there is the mission, but that loyalty that the individual. Have to each other, and in this case to you as their commanding officer.

Now, with that mindset, you continued excelling, . You've had a couple of very unique experiences, including serving as the 22nd senior director in the White House situation room. What was that experience like for you, Admiral? 

[00:08:44] Kyle Cozad: So it really was unusual, and I describe myself as a unicorn every now and then because, that job came about I had just graduated from the national defense University in DC and I was notified that they wanted to nominate me.

My career managers wanted to nominate me for this job at it's White House. And I was, at that point in my career, I was. Send me where you need to. That sounds really interesting. And really after a long interview process of about three and a half months when I was selected and I went to work, I realized that, so I was the number two guy, came in as the director of operations and I worked for the senior director who had actually been a c i A officer for his entire career.

And so he was the expert on intelligence, gathering dissemination. What was really important about that. I was familiar with that, but really My expertise slide in, watchful or management qualification. Standardization in hiring. And we played off of each other's strengths and I'd say it was a non-traditional job because, it was a very small staff.

But, it was all about, trust. I can't think of any other job that I've done during the 35 years of my uniform service when I went home late at. And I tried to get my five or six hours of sleep. We had a young, 26, 27 year old watch officer who was in the White House situation room that was empowered and expected to make decisions of notification.

It wasn't about call me first and ask me my opinion. These were potentially, life and death decisions that had to be made. And from a notification perspective, it was about instilling that trust. For me to be able to get out what in the military we called our commander's intent.

This is what we expect you to do. This is what we expect you to think about, and when you'd answered all those questions, then act on it. We trust you to do that. And, that was probably the most significant part of, the job at the White House situation room was getting, young men and women from across the intelligence community.

And we had a few Department of Defense officers in there and have 'em more cohesively as a highly functioning. 

[00:10:39] Mahan Tavakoli: What tremendous opportunity, Admiral and I could spend hours just on that specific time in your life. Couple of points that you mentioned, I wanted to underline and we could spend hours talking about them.

One is the trust that is placed in the individuals, in this case, the 26 year old officer. Yeah. And the importance of that as well as what you talked about with respect to military, that commander's intent. One of the challenges a lot of teams and organizations have is lack of clarity in what that intent is.

Therefore, a desire. To micromanage the smallest things that people in the team do. So in this instance, most of the teams and organizations that I interact with can learn from both commanders intents and the trust that is placed on people when appropriately trained to make the right decision.

And. 

[00:11:43] Kyle Cozad: Yeah so part of that and it's very important, and I learned this probably, when I was a lieutenant commander. So I've probably been in 11 or 12 years it's always easier to micromanage. You know exactly what you want and , instead of developing a subordinate, it's always easier to say, give it here, I'll do it for you.

But, quite frankly, that's counterproductive. And in the White House situation room, just like I did in a squadron, just like I did in a wing I wanted to be out and about. I wanted to talk and the thing that underpins that, the characteristic is clear communications don't send an email and forget about it and say, I'm sure everybody 

understands exactly what I expect them to do or want them to do. It was the opportunity for, at a morning standup or an afternoon standup when you have a new watch team on board to be very crystal clear and hey, this is what's important. These are priorities for today. But also the opportunity to walk around and, just talk to people casually.

To reinforce and answer questions. And I think, we were very successful there during a time during the Arab Spring. So it seemed like, there were different revolutions in different countries every month for a period of time. And then certainly during the bin Laden mission that really was spawned there in the White House situation room.

[00:12:51] Mahan Tavakoli: Those are incredible historical moments when you served in the White House situation, room now, Admiral, all throughout these years you continued nurturing great people, supporting great people, having great people around you. One of the challenges in leadership is that as people move up in organiz, everyone becomes much more respectful and differential to their point of view, and it becomes more hesitant in challenging them and therefore that causes issues and problems. So as you were moving up the ranks, how were you making sure that there was the appropriate respect for you and your role, but.

Your team was willing and people were willing to challenge your thoughts and share ideas with you the way they saw them, rather than what they thought you wanted to hear. That's 

[00:13:49] Kyle Cozad: a great question. And I think for me, so this goes back to, you have to be relatable to your organization and they have to have trust in you.

They have to understand that you're honest in your assessment because typically when the new CEO comes on board or the new commanding officer comes on board, you're gonna sit down and you're gonna express some of your leadership preferences, your expectations of the team.

And the first time you say that I expect you to push back. I expect you to challenge assumptions. And you're in a public meeting and you rip somebody's head off because they did exactly what you told them. You are done. You've completely disestablished any credibility you have. It's a willingness to trust people.

And, I think as a leader, it's important to know. How much risk you can absorb. When can I allow somebody to make a subtle mistake and learn from it and, develop themselves as opposed to something that's gonna be a little more catastrophic. Obviously, during the Bin Laden mission, there was no room for error.

And so there was a little more heavy handed, a little more guidance, a little more direction, but something that wasn't as, maybe significant, you had to give folks that opportunity to, develop themselves and every opportunity I saw when somebody said let's try this, or have you thought about this?

It's easy for a leader to jump right in and interrupt somebody. But to be an active listener and to absorb to understand and then to have a conversation on some of those decisions is such a powerful developmental tool for the young folks that work. 

[00:15:17] Mahan Tavakoli: Admiral, you went on and you had the opportunity to serve as Commander of Naval Education and Training Command, which is broad scope, all the training that's done.

But I would love to get your perspectives and thoughts with respect to the fact that some of the cultural elements, some of the leadership elements are learned. At the same time some of them are taught. How were you able to focus on teaching the right leadership and the new culture in that the culture of US military has transitioned over the years.

So how were you able to make sure that there was the culture change and the appropriate training on the leadership? It's 

[00:16:02] Kyle Cozad: a super question, and I'm gonna start with kind of the fundamental training block that we have, and that's our bootcamp, recruit, training command up in Great Lakes, Illinois. And as I became indoctrinated into the mission and again at Naval Education Training Command, I was responsible for all Navy recruiting.

I. For bootcamp for officer candidate school and then all the technical schools. Just over 50,000 people to include students, instructors, and civilians that supported that. And so the one thing I I learned really early, there was a big discussion of, are we tough enough as a service?

And, what are our values look like? I am of the opinion that you can't take a young, 18, 19, 20 year old man or woman off the streets from very different places, and in eight weeks expect them to all have the same lens of what looks like. And I'll just use that as the example, because somebody may have come from a broken home, somebody may have come from, an environment where they were actually in a gang or they did other things and somebody else was.

That kid who had a golden spoon in his mouth and mom and dad brought him or her everything that they wanted. And it's really more of an evolution. And so one of the things that, I tried to focus on was you need to set the standard of Zoom Bootcamp, but you need to reinforce those same things because.

You can't change an individual character in a matter of eight to 10 weeks. That's a two or a three year process. So there has to be consistency. Unfortunately, I owned all of those schools from kind of street to fleet that we were able to at least turn that up just a bit. 

The most interesting point of this was, I had 20 something commanding officers in, probably a hundred different locations around the country that were responsible , to me. I had to be really clear in, my expectations, my guidance, but then, It was up to them, they were running their commands.

And when I would visit, I'd get a sense for, who was really doing it, the right way and who was being maybe that heavy-handed leader that was leading by intimidation or fear as opposed to leading the right way. 

[00:17:55] Mahan Tavakoli: So as you are leading this admiral, you made great inroads all throughout then March 16th, 2018, what.

[00:18:08] Kyle Cozad: Needless to say St. Patrick's Day isn't my favorite holiday anymore. So I had been at Naval Education and Training Command for probably six months. And it was just like any other day. Had family in town actually. And we lived in a 10,000 square foot historic home that went along with a job.

And that evening, I was the last one to go to bed. This Home was built originally in the early 1830s and it had very narrow steps, very steep steps, and a very low handrail that took us up to our second floor where we had our master bedroom and guest bedrooms.

And I really don't have much recollection. What exactly happened, as I pieced things together I probably lost my balance on the second or third floor tumbled over the banister and landed on my back. And that resulted in, two broken vertebrae significant spinal cord trauma and injury.

And I can barely remember. The frustration and the misunderstanding, the confusion I had when I couldn't stand up, when I couldn't even move my legs. And at that point I was concerned, I was worried. But the next thing I knew, I woke up in a hospital after seven hours of surgery, almost 24 hours later.

So 

[00:19:17] Mahan Tavakoli: you woke up in the hospital? What happened then? 

[00:19:22] Kyle Cozad: So I called those first couple days in the I C U. My why me stage Because I think anybody who has, a major circumstance in life, a catastrophic illness or injury, always immediately says, why me?

At this point, I was a successful naval officer. I was healthy, I was fit. I loved the outdoors. I loved to exercise, run fish and do all those things. And when I woke up, it didn't take me long to realize. I can't move my legs. I don't even have any feeling below my waist. And so when my neurosurgeon and wife came in and, he wanted to delicately break the news to me I already knew what he was gonna tell me.

He took that to another level because he said, Hey, based on the severity of your injury and it was too vertebrae for me just below the lower back. T 12 to L two. He said, I'm afraid you're never gonna get out of a wheelchair again. You'll never be able to stand and you'll be confined to this for the rest of your life.

And obviously, a kick in the gut and I was still on painkillers. And so immediately my mind rushed to how am I gonna take care of my family? I'm a caregiver. I've gotta nurture the family. I've gotta take care of 'em. But, now the Navy's gonna force me to retire.

I've gotta move into a small one story ranch house that, is boring. I've gotta do this, I've gotta do that. I've gotta buy a van, a minivan that has a wheelchair entrance on it again. And so I immediately went into. A survival mode. How do I take care of my family and can I afford to take care of my family?

But, I really pushed past that in probably two or three days even before I left the I C U.  When I had read something or I had seen something, I realized at that point I had a decision to make and I could stay in this why me phase and feel sorry for it.

And lay in bed and watch ESPN for 23 hours a day, or I could find a new purpose for this. Do you know what's the purpose of my accident? Because, I'm a believer that, God closes one door, but he opens three others. And so I was looking for those three other doors to help me define the purpose and what I could do.

What positives could I make out of a catastrophic accident, like this one? 

[00:21:23] Mahan Tavakoli: I'm sure you're familiar with Kubler Ross's stages of grief when people go through this. There's denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and finally acceptance in. Many instances, people don't move beyond denial and anger, let alone get to the other stages.

And in other instances it takes years, if not decades, to go through that. How were you able to shift your thinking? This is incredible. You are at the height of your career as you mentioned leading naval education and training command When this happens, how were you able. In a few days in the I C U of the hospital to be able to shift your mindset.

[00:22:11] Kyle Cozad: So part of it was I had a daughter who happened to be in town at the time of my ex, actually, both my daughters were in town and so I had a chance to see them. My son who was also a naval aviator who's getting ready to go on his very first deployment. I'll tell you one of my motivating stories about my son, Dan here in a few minutes.

But they were all there and I leaned on the fact that the family was there. I leaned on my faith to get beyond kind of step two and step three and just go to what's the next purpose. And I don't consider it acceptance. I just consider it. I'm gonna, I'm gonna acknowledge and 

I'm gonna own this, I'm gonna make it happen. And you mentioned the depression phase. It was funny when I was in the I C U, my nurses would come in every two or three hours and, they'd have a bucket of pills and medicine for me. And I would always ask, I said, okay, what's that do?

What's that for? And most of them made sense. This is a painkiller, this is a blood thinner. This is gonna help you heal. This is gonna do this is gonna do that. But, one of the pills was an antidepressant. And I said why do I need. And really she vocalized exactly what you had just said.

When people have a life altering injury like this, sometimes they'll go into a very depressed state and, it's hard for them to come out. And that was the final snap of the fingers where I would say I sprinted through the first three or four stages of, denial and I went right to acceptance from the stage.

I don't accept the fact that the doctor told me I'm never gonna get out of a chair. I accept the fact that I have a new purpose and it's time for me to figure out what that purpose is. 

[00:23:35] Mahan Tavakoli: And you mentioned your son and his story played a role in inspiring you as 

[00:23:40] Kyle Cozad: well. Yeah so there were a couple things, when people said what motivated you, what inspired you?

So my son was about ready to go on his very first cruise. So he was gonna be gone for seven months. He's a helicopter. He was gonna be on a small destroyer, I believe it was at the time. And so we'd have very little communications with him. And, he offered to my wife, he said, Hey, I'll ask, and I'm sure they'll approve this if I can stay behind for a couple weeks and just help with whatever I can do.

And my wife Amy, who we also need to talk about the importance of caregivers in my story and similar stories. But she said she didn't even hesitate. She said, Nope, you go do the job you were trained to do. You go out there, you fly safely and you come back in seven months. This was two days.

Mind you, after the doctor had come in and said, I was never gonna get out of a wheelchair, she said, don't worry about your dad because he's gonna walk out and he's gonna give you a hug when you fly back into n e s Jacksonville. And my immediate, response was, the 17 year old eye roll I roll my eyes and I said, sweetheart, did you not hear what the doctor said?

 She always says that, she's a very positive person as well. The power of positive thinking and, that was the first indication that, she was all in on my recovery as well. 

[00:24:48] Mahan Tavakoli: That's beautiful to hear. Admiral, I know before starting recording, you were also mentioning your love and admiration for Amy, your wife, and her support for you.

You are a very positive person, but there are times we need other people who. Have that positive energy and believe in us. So what role did Amy play in keeping you positive and motivated? 

[00:25:15] Kyle Cozad: So probably the most important role, and in relentless positivity. I talk a lot about my time in the hospital and just being a people watcher and.

I think one of the key components, whether you're in the hospital and again, I like to call 'em circumstances. My circumstance was spinal cord injury where, I didn't have any feeling below the waist and I was gonna be like that for the rest of my life. Maybe for somebody else, it's cancer diagnosis, maybe for somebody else it's.

Maybe, less significant in the big scheme of things like failure to get a promotion or a raise, failure to get a job or, maybe I got a nick on my car at the grocery store. But, having a support network was so important for me and Amy was that support network.

We made a decision early in the process when. They were gonna transfer me from, my primary I c u inpatient experience to another rehabilitation hospital. We decided that we wanna stay in Pensacola because that way she could be guaranteed that she was gonna be available for each and every one of my.

Physical therapy sessions, occupational therapy sessions, and some days she was there as my cheerleader. Other days she was there as my nurse crat. So she'd kick me in the butt if I needed her to. And, she was that inspiration. And every time, I would get this glimmer in the back of my mind that, Hey, this is too hard.

This is too hard. I think about Amy and I think about my family. And Realization was magnified by about a million times the first week we were at home. So we'd been released from the hospital. I couldn't get into that big historic house cuz I couldn't climb the steps. There were 10 steps just to get to the main level.

And I had a hospital bed and a TV and a bathroom that had been rigged with grab bars and, an accessible toilet and a hospital bed there. And she had to do everyth. That the nurses did. And we had taken that for granted. And so she unwittingly assumed the role as a, primary caregiver.

And, you want to think a spouse is a difficult role. Turn that up by about 110. And that's what a caregiver really does. It's unselfish. They didn't ask to be put in that position, but whether it's a parent, a good friend or a wife or a husband, she gave it all to help push me, to help encourage me and to help me get to the level where I am today.

[00:27:24] Mahan Tavakoli: What a wonderful tribute to her love and care, and there are a lot of caregivers, Admiral, who deserve similar shout outs in that when people are able to make it through tough times, a lot of times they have. Benefited from the love and support of others who have given them care and given them strength when they have needed it.

Now, admir, Merle Wonder, you had a great. As you mentioned, upbringing, supportive parents and family all throughout. So this positivity that you have and you had even after this accident, is it something that you had, regardless of what had happened to you, you would have viewed it with a positive lens?

Or is it something that people can develop? 

[00:28:20] Kyle Cozad: That's a great question. For me, I think , it was. In my core fiber, I'm always a glass half full guy. I'm gonna figure things out and I wouldn't say I was relentlessly positive about becoming a paraplegic, but I'm relentlessly positive in my approach to recovery.

And quite frankly, beating the battle of my life. There are components to this. So there's a toughness component to this. There's a grittiness component, a resilience component to making me, to helping me believe that I can do this.

If you think back to what I told you earlier about my family cannot, can't, was not in our vocabulary. And that continues to push me going forward. I'll tell you the, one of the things that, continue to inspire me and. Network perspective was when I, first started adaptive sports.

I was invited to, go to an introductory camp, we'll call it. And I went to an introductory camp and I learned a few things. And, I met other people who had suffered significant injuries like mine. There were some amputees, there were a few other folks who were wheelchair bound but other folks who had invisible injuries or were cancer survivors.

And the opportunity to network with folks who had gone through similarly catastrophic events in their lives, gave me an opportunity to look and say. Hey, this is why, you need to be tough. You need to be positive about how you approach this. And so that network was super, super important to me.

 There was one guy on our team and for obvious reasons, I won't use names, he had, had a significant injury and he was probably at that significant depression stage. Having a purpose of adaptive sports, having, a newly acquired family of other adaptive athletes on the Navy team, he turned that around and, made himself an ambassador of recovery, ambassador of positive, vibes.

And, we took inspiration off that. That was more about, the network and sharing positive vibes than it was about winning medals or, doing anything like that. It was really more about, making those connections and, when it came to the sports, just doing your personal best, doing better today than you did yesterday.

[00:30:20] Mahan Tavakoli: That is impressive including the fact that you competed in the defense warrior Games admiral. So you drew energy from these folks, but kept that competitive spirit alive as well. 

[00:30:33] Kyle Cozad: Yeah, I don't know if I kept it alive or they kept it alive for me , our tryout camps, we went around and introduced ourselves and, word yet out.

I was no doubt about it. I was the most senior person. I was a two-star admiral. And we had a lot of, junior officers and very junior enlisted folks there. And I made a purpose to say, don't call me anything other than Kyle. We're teammate and we're family here. And some reluctantly, others not so reluctantly we're able to do that.

And I also said and don't feel sorry for me to take it easy on me because I'm the old guy and dog on it. They took that literally, and they would put my butt. I would push them, they would push me. And as luck would have it I ended up winning a gold medal in one of the seated I think it was discus events.

And, again, it wasn't I say that it's not about the metal, it's just about. Doing better and improving yourself day after day. But I had a news reporter who did a morning interview with me. And, I didn't mention anything about the metal, and she had heard about it and she said, is that really important?

I said no, it's not as important as this, that, or the other. Then I smiled at her and said, but if you try to take it from me, you're gonna have to grab it from my lifeless fingers. 

[00:31:36] Mahan Tavakoli: You had worked 

[00:31:37] Kyle Cozad: hard for it, you deserved it. I did. 

[00:31:42] Mahan Tavakoli: That's wonderful, Admiral. And I think part of it is through your story.

You can also serve as inspiration as you mentioned, for countless other people that face difficulties in their lives. And we have a choice to make. We don't always have a choice to what happens to us. We have a choice to make. Things happen to us, whether small or much more significant. There was an article maybe Times article, meet the Admiral who leads from a wheelchair.

I enjoyed the article, but I also enjoy a couple of pictures in there, including a young woman shaking your hand and you can tell she is inspired by you. So your example as a leader serves. A way of inspiring others. So I think it's really important in you sharing your story as well as the fact that people can look and learn from the example, the way you live your life and you lead your life rather than just what you say about your life.

[00:32:47] Kyle Cozad: Yeah. So first off, thanks and I appreciate that it's always humbling to, hear others' perspective, but there are probably a couple components to that. So the first thing , even when I guess the very first time I stood up in physical therapy and I didn't do that on my own, it's this big clunky machine and I had seat belts on and straps around my shoulders and, it was like a big crank and it would pull me outta my wheelchair.

And for the first time I was six foot four again. And at that very, I told my wife, I said, I want to go back. I wanna resume full duty in the Navy. And if you think about that's a crazy idea. I was a guy in a wheelchair for the rest of my life, the Navy accommodated me.

The Navy said, we don't care about your mobility, or we care less about your mobility than what you have in your heart. And what you have in your mind to give and what could motivate you more than that. And that became an opportunity to get out and about and be publicly visible and show people that, regardless of what your circumstance, even if it was a disability that you can do these things.

And that kind of led. Is as I got into adaptive sports and I had my Navy teammates, I'd do one-on-one mentoring. If I found out about somebody who had a similar injury, I'd always offer myself and they'd contact me and, I'd tell my story, tell 'em, what worked for me the things that inspired me, and then.

Amy also made herself available to the mothers and fathers or the husbands and wives, who could also talk about, this new unassuming role as a caregiver. And, I got to the point where, maybe I was touching two dozen or three dozen people, I really felt telling that story to other people was important enough that I decided to write the book.

And, in doing so we made another family decision and, I look back on 35 years in the Navy. That made me tough, that gave me the tools to be able to deal with an injury like this. And so a hundred percent of the proceeds from relentless positivity go right back to the Naval Aviation Museum here in Pensacola, Florida.

So we can tell the stories of real heroes, not heroes like Kyle Coed. 

[00:34:44] Mahan Tavakoli: And you do a great job with that Admiral. So what is the Naval Aviation Museum Foundation, which you are the President and c e o of and the proceeds from the book go to the foundation? What is it all about? 

[00:35:01] Kyle Cozad: So we're the nonprofit organization that helps sustain the National Naval Aviation Museum here in Pensacola.

 So Pensacola, Florida is the cradle of naval aviation. Everybody, whether you fly, whether you operate a weapon system or you're an enlisted technician, every aviator in the United States, Navy comes through Pensacola and their training. So we've got this beautiful museum here and it was our mission to make things better, to be able.

To tell stories of, world War II heroes to tell stories of prisoners of war who served eight and a half years in the Hanoi Hilton. And so this is just one of those fundraising initiatives that helps me propagate all those stories for folks who might not otherwise know about. And, 

[00:35:43] Mahan Tavakoli: I think it would be worth people visiting it.

It sounds though, at this point you need to have a military ID to be able to. 

[00:35:53] Kyle Cozad: You do, we're hoping to be able to solve that. We had an unfortunate circumstances terrorism attack back in 2019 when, I was the commander of naval education or training command. And for the last four years since we reside on the base itself only D O D I D card holders, so active duty, retired military independence can get on unless they're escorted by a friend who has those same credentials.

So my mission in life right now is to be able to reverse that and get it to a point where, this great museum is open to the entire public. 

[00:36:23] Mahan Tavakoli: We look forward to that. And Admiral, one of the people whose story I've fallen in love with over the past few years, I didn't know as much about him, was Admiral Stockdale and His experience in the Hanoi Hilton and the life lessons that he learned and he shared as a result of that.

So it's incredible when people can go through the most brutal experiences or accidents like yours, but can become. Even better, stronger, contribute more to people around them, contribute more to the community, to the country. Building off of the tragedy. Or the horrible experience that they endured.

[00:37:10] Kyle Cozad: And I've been able to thrive off that same energy. And I read Admiral Stockdale's book in Love and War many years ago. And actually I had somebody comment online that, relentless positivity reminded them of that same dialogue back and forth between the admiral and his wife cil.

Cuz Amy has some parts in there where, she shares some caring bridge stories and shares her perspective. But since that time, I've been able to. Get to know a couple other prisoners of war. A guy named Charlie Plum who I met with, probably about the same time the Navy Times put out their article and, he came, he visited me in my office and we talked about resilience and, it was a good opportunity for me to.

Share his experiences of what he went through and compare and contrast those with what I went through. Since then commander Everett Alvarez, who lives in the Washington DC area, was the Navy's longest, p o w in confinement. In he was shot down as a young man, spent eight and a half years in a prisoner of war camp in North Vietnam.

And when I talk to Evan and when I talk to his wife Tammy, and I compare my situation to what he went through. He may tell me he would trade places with me. I may tell him I trade places with him, but, again it's the resolve. It's the human resolve and the human spirit that pushes you to do things that others don't think you're otherwise capable of doing.

[00:38:27] Mahan Tavakoli: And your book, serves as an inspiration with beautiful stories of that human resolve. Now, having gone through this, admiral, I would love to get your thoughts and perspectives in that you were very mindful, engaged leader, which contributed to. Rising through the ranks and becoming an admiral and the different opportunities that you had, including becoming commander of Naval Education and Training Command.

I wonder though, in what ways are you even better and more evolved as a leader after having gone. This experience post March 16th, 2018 accident. 

[00:39:13] Kyle Cozad: So you can probably characterize both of these as soft leadership skills. But I am certainly mindful and I tell people all the time, if I put a personal signature in the book that you know, I'll send you when we're done with this, it's gonna talk about 

you can't. A single day in your life or a single moment in your life for granted, you have to make a difference. And, don't put off making a difference in your life or someone else's life until tomorrow because you don't know what tomorrow's gonna bring for you. The other piece of this is, since I've retired, I've realized the understanding and what it really means to balance work and life.

When I was in the military, I would. Leave and leave meant you left the office, you went somewhere with your family, but you always had an iPhone or a Blackberry or a laptop, and you were never disconnected from work. I've made a personal resolution that, we go on vacation for four weeks a year.

I unplug I don't answer phone calls. As a matter of fact we went to Breckenridge Colorado last summer, and I forgot to bring the charger for my watch, and it went black. And quite frankly, it could have been black for three days and I didn't even know it, but we were there in the moment.

 Was able to spend time with my wife and, really reconnect and reenergize our batteries. Those are the big things. But I will tell you that as I look back and, I consider this. Deliberate character development. So throughout, the phases of anyone's career being given the opportunities, but also seizing the opportunities to develop as a leader is super important.

And, I look back and, I talked about my leadership style as, trying to develop everybody, have them understand commander's intent and empowering them to do their job well. I think the best illustration of that, and it's probably very unique, is when. I was in the recovery room.

I had an individual on my staff that came in. And I'm retired now, so I'm sure there's no statute of limitations on this. He asked my wife for my ID card so that they could access my email account. And my staff, I had trained them in those six months. And I'm proud of this.

I don't say this with a boastful nature, but I'm proud of what they became. They were able to run naval education and training command, the largest shore command in the United States Navy for about six weeks until I was able to, look at one email every hour or make a phone call.

And the active delegation is a real thing and we want to train our subordinates to be able to take over in the worst of circumstances and absent going to war I felt like I had one of the worst circumstances that certainly I could ever imagine, and they performed like super. 

[00:41:43] Mahan Tavakoli: And they performed like superstars in part because of their leader.

Admiral, I love a Lak quote, and it's something that I see in the greatest leaders. When they are gone, people do as well, if not better, and say we did it ourselves. That is the mark of a great leader, whether it is a c e O. There's a lot written most recently about Jack Welsh and how GE crumbled Post Jack Welsh or in Florida the c e o Bob Iger, who was a great c e O of Disney, however, Ended up replacing himself with someone that he had to come back and rescue Disney from.

The greatest leaders. The best leaders are those whose teams can do even better without the leader around, and the organization does better after the leader. So you are one of those great leaders where your team was able to continue on without needing your ongoing inactive involvement. So I wonder, Admiral, throughout the.

As well as over the past few years. Are there any leadership resources, practices, books, anything that you typically find yourself recommending to others as they want to learn to become as great as you are in leadership? 

[00:43:08] Kyle Cozad: I was a big Vince Lombardi fan, everything that I did, boiled back to sports.

And I'd read the common leadership books, but I got less outta those than I did of, listening to people like Vince Lombardi, how to motivate a team, how to motivate a bunch of professional athletes. And, that's really what I leaned on. And, at the end of the day, I think Vince Lombardi.

Had that same dad factor about him, his players didn't want to disappoint him. And, I worked hard to gain the trust. I worked hard to gain the loyalty and to create an environment in whatever organization I was part of where it felt like family. I think when people are invested, they will perform.

And I don't want to correct you, when I asked my staff how they had done so well, they said the better we did. We were just hoping the longer we could keep you away from the office.

And I'm sure they said that with love in their hearts. 

[00:43:59] Mahan Tavakoli: Mutual love and affection. That's wonderful. Now, Admiral, how best can the audience find out more about relentless positivity and connect with you? 

[00:44:12] Kyle Cozad: We sell the book in our museum store and it's a unique opportunity because I will sign each one of those copies, and I'll do a personalized not to you.

And so you can order that through naval aviation.com and a V A L. aviation.com, or you can buy it at any Barnes and Nobles or buy them on Amazon . Sales of the book have been, pretty positive. I'd ask that you write a review if you like it. If you don't like it, then don't leave anything.

And I'm on rear Admiral kc on Instagram as well. And, people can reach out to me. I've got a LinkedIn account as well. Reach out to me. I do public speaking now. I'll answer any questions, start a conversation or provide whatever advice or conversation that anyone wants to have that's 

[00:44:53] Mahan Tavakoli: outstanding.

We will put a link , in the show notes, to all of the sites and resources that you mentioned. Admiral, I love reading your book. At the very beginning, you have a quote there from John Quincy Adams, where if your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more, and become more, you are a leader, Admiral Kyle.

Not only are you a leader, thank you for helping us through sharing your story with relentless positivity for all of us to become better leaders. Thank you so much for this conversation, Kyle. Colette, 

[00:45:45] Kyle Cozad: it was my honor. Thanks so much for having me today.